Talk:Timeline

From Tolkien Gateway

Just discovered this when searching for Goldilocks Gardner...
One simple yet life-altering question: should this timeline have any other links in it? *dreads* --Bokkie 18:52, 9 Sep 2005 (EDT)

FA Errors

There are two of the year 471! [Just copy 'n pasted from Halion's Excel file "Tale of Years" I guess ;)]

Isn't Saelind (born 344) the same person as Andreth (born 361)? [Couldn't find the both of them in the Indices of the Silm or UT. btw.]

Non-canon

I had an idea that I wanted to make sure it was fine before I did it. Many of the dates are disputed. Perhaps an asterisk could be added to those ones? --Narfil Palùrfalas 21:50, 9 June 2006 (EDT)

Great idea! Maybe later we can delve in deeper as to the range and other possibilities for the date but I think an asterisk would be a great addition to let people know its not an exact fact. --Hyarion 22:07, 9 June 2006 (EDT)

A More Accurate Timeline?

I found this timeline for the Elder Days that looks much more accurate. Would anyone object to replacing the info here for the other Elder Days timeline? --Ebakunin 00:50, 10 July 2006 (EDT)

Fine by me, although maybe we could make a quick run through to make sure they didn't leave anything out that we already have, otherwise it looks great. I'm not sure copying it entirely would be the most legal thing either, maybe we can rewrite it in our own words. --Hyarion 09:26, 10 July 2006 (EDT)

Fourth Age years?

Perhaps I'm just bad in numbers, but it seems to me that to many of the years of the F.A. are not correct.

According to the Tale of Years (p. 1098 in my 2004 edition) king Elessar died in S.R. 1541 which was the year 120 of the Fourth Age (Gondor) - see footnote 1. Thus one should retract 1421 from the S.R. years to get the F.A. years. Am I right? This would cause changes to all the years that are changed from the S.R. to the F.A. years (1 > T.A. 3021, 3 > 2, 5 > 4 and so on).

Some other comments:

1 Éomer and Lothiriel wed, Elanor Gardner born ---> T.A. 3021; by the way: Elanor Gardner or Elanor Gamgee or Elanor the Fair? I just thought that only Frodo had the surname Gardner

24 Death of Imrahil. Elphir becomes Prince of Dol Amroth. Firiel Gardner born ---Who is this Firiel? As far as I know, Tolman was the youngest of the children of Sam and Rosie. And I suppose that the name should be Fíriel, not Firiel, if anything.

62 Death of Rose Gardner. Círdan and Samwise pass over sea ---Rose Gamgee, I suppose. Or did Samwise really change his name to Gardner??

--Tik 17:04, 27 July 2006 (EDT)


Morgoth or Melkor? Years of the Lamps?

Perhaps I'm just hypercritical or smth, but I think there is a kind of anachronism if Melkor is called Morgoth already in the Years of the Lamps. - By the way, is this a generally accepted term? I suppose that Tolkien himself did not use it. In the Annals of Aman (HoME X, 51) he only talks about "the Days before days" and does not specifically name the period of 3500 Valian Years before the flowering of the Trees. All in all, the Years of the Lamps only begun ca. 1500 Valian Years [i]after[/i] the beginning of this reckoning (with the arrival of the Valar to Arda). The Years of the Lamps are only a part of this Age.

--Tik 17:25, 27 July 2006 (EDT)

I'm not sure about your second question, but as to the first one, no, Melkor was not named Morgoth until he destroyed the Two Trees. See the quote below:
" [Fëanor has just been told of Formenos by messengers, how his father was killed and the Silmarils taken] . . . Then Fëanor rose, and lifting up his hand before Manwë he cursed Melkor, naming him Morgoth, the Black Foe of the World; and by that name only was he known to the Eldar ever after. . ."
The Silmarillion, "Of the Flight of the Noldor"
Do you mind rephrasing your second question a little? --Narfil Palùrfalas 17:46, 27 July 2006 (EDT)